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Author Topic: Royal Protocol Including How To Dress and Behave  (Read 7414 times)
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YooperModerator
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« on: May 30, 2014, 01:02:34 am »

This is a thread to discuss any royal protocol or etiquette issues involving royalty.  This includes how to dress, behave, and any information on meeting, addressing or contacting a member of a royal family.  I am including a post from another member to begin the discussion.   thankyou


^^I'm sure you're right about that and am considering starting a "Royal (Dress?) Protocol" or something  thread but wondered if you or anyone else know if there is such a thing that is written down or is just simply an understanding?  I would imagine there is a protocol for when one visits the Queen, for instance, but honestly hadn't thought of it before.  Thanks.

It's more a set of standards and understanding that have been passed down but quite frankly, nothing that hasn't been deemed the standard of formal propriety in a lot of western societies and cultures, though I'm sure many would deem a lot of it old-fashioned: knee length skirts, low heels which I'm sure mean 3" or less. I know there it's been mentioned a couple of times that the Queen's dresser touches on it in her book: http://www.amazon.com/Dressing-Queen-The-Jubilee-Wardrobe/dp/1905686749

I believe Diana and Sophie and others have talked about it too, so you could google and find some quotes.

This is from Kate Middleton Criticism who got it from the BRF's official site & britishroyalgoogler
Quote
For reporters and guests:

“Journalists wishing to cover Royal engagements, whether in the United Kingdom or abroad, should comply with the dress code on formal occasions out of respect for the guests of The Queen, or any other member of the Royal Family.

Smart attire for men includes the wearing of a jacket and tie, and for women a trouser or skirt suit. Those wearing jeans or trainers will not be admitted and casually dressed members of the media will be turned away. This also applies to technicians.”

Outings for the Royal Women:

“It’s an unwritten rule that royal ambassadors and guests attend events dressed to make the queen proud: closed-toed shoes, mid-length skirts and pantyhose.”

“Inch thick straps or sleeves are highly recommended on any outfit or dress.”

“Dresses hemlines are to be weighted.”

“Low necklines are highly frowned upon. It is most acceptable to only show the start of the swell of the breast if necessary. No neckline will be acceptable if it falls between or below the breasts.”

Black Tie Attire for Royal Women:

“Ladies should wear an evening or cocktail dress (it is best not to wear black, which is really only appropriate only when the Court is in mourning).”

“Low necklines are highly frowned upon. It is most acceptable to only show the start of the swell of the breast if necessary. No neckline will be acceptable if it falls between or below the breasts.”

White Tie Attire for Royal Women:

“White tie involves a long evening dresses with long gloves and best jewellery including tiaras for the ladies. Orders and decorations are worn by everyone entitled to do so, though it is important not to wear the collar of an order (these never appear after sunset).”

“Dresses are to be structured as not to cause an indecent slip of the flesh.”

“Inch thick straps or sleeves are highly recommended on any outfit or dress.”

“Low necklines are highly frowned upon. It is most acceptable to only show the start of the swell of the breast if necessary. No neckline will be acceptable if it falls between or below the breasts.”

Royal Ascot:

From the Ascot Racecourse site: “Her Majesty’s Representative wishes to point out that only formal day dress with a hat or substantial fascinator will be acceptable. Off the shoulder, halter neck, spaghetti straps and dresses with a strap of less than one inch and miniskirts are considered unsuitable. Midriffs must be covered and trouser suits must be full length and of matching material and colour.

Gentlemen are required to wear either black or grey morning dress, including a waistcoat, with a top hat. A gentleman may remove his top hat within a restaurant, a private box, a private club or that facility’s terrace, balcony or garden. Hats may also be removed within any enclosed external seating area within the Royal Enclosure Garden.”

(P.S. Now Dressing The Queen, The Queen's Diamonds, and Diamonds: A Jubilee Celebration are going on my extremely long list of books to purchase easter-lol)
« Last Edit: May 30, 2014, 01:07:39 am by YooperModerator » Logged


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« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2014, 01:27:29 am »

thanks for posting this


You're most welcome!  I look forward to learning here.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2014, 01:31:19 am by YooperModerator » Logged
Rosella
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« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2014, 01:28:33 am »

I love the 'Dresses are to be structured as not to cause an indecent slip of the flesh.' in the Protocol.

With regard to peep-toe shoes however, I'm sure I've seen photos of Princess Margaret wearing them. They were extremely popular in the 1950's especially in warmer climates. Margaret did go to various parts of the Caribbean representing the Queen as a young woman.
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« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2014, 01:29:56 am »

Oh Waity, Waity, Waity. You wouldn't know propriety if the rules were handed to you in black & white.

Quote
“Dresses hemlines are to be weighted.”

 laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh She just ignores

Quote
“Low necklines are highly frowned upon. It is most acceptable to only show the start of the swell of the breast if necessary. No neckline will be acceptable if it falls between or below the breasts.”

 shifty shifty shifty V-cut showing too much

Quote
“Dresses are to be structured as not to cause an indecent slip of the flesh.”

 eating cookies eating cookies eating cookies Well we've seen all of her flesh

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« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2014, 02:06:22 am »

Okay, so I dd some more digging and apparently Debretts is the go to for all things British etiquette (also American etiquette as it's not much different):

As far as dress they state the same thing I posted above. It's more in reference to what the public should wear but it's basically the same as what the royals themselves wear minus  trooping of the color and things like that.

http://www.debretts.com/forms-address/royal-family/communicating-queen

http://www.debretts.com/forms-address/royal-family/other-members-royal-family Pay no attention to Kate's hard face and William's clenched jaw


It's actually a very cute website and I like their little shop. Oh great, more things to put on the 'Buy' list tehe
« Last Edit: May 30, 2014, 02:16:58 am by CarryingOn » Logged
YooperModerator
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« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2014, 06:54:16 am »

^Cool info and stuff!  Thank you.
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« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2014, 03:49:43 pm »

This couple has no idea about etiquette whatsoever. The placement of the royal guests at the Abbey made that perfectly clear.

They seated the guests in alphabetical order which is against every royal/ diplomatic protocol there is. Of the foreign royal guests, Queen Margrethe should have taken precedence over all guests, as longest-reigning (foreign) monarch. Queen Sofia should have come second. Crown Princess Victoria should have been seated before the (then) Prince of Orange and Princess Maxima since the father of Victoria reigned prior to Beatrix (1973 v 1980).

This having said, I am looking forward to royal events in say ten years. By then, William will most likely be Prince of Wales and will be present at at least the highest royal events. And he will rank behind both the Princess of Oranje (Amalia) and the Duchess of Brabant (Elisabeth) since their fathers, Willem-Alexander and Philippe, bu then have reigned longer than Charles.
I would love to see the sulking look on Kate's face at events like that. On the other hand, I hope she won't be around by then after being ditched by William.
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« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2014, 09:10:47 pm »

Oh yeah how the royal guests were placed was so strange. However, I do not think it was WillKat's fault. I imagine they chose where to seat their friends but left the other guests to the palace.

What I want to see is any of the continental royals getting the garter. But I suppose they won't get it until their parents die. 
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« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2014, 09:19:19 pm »

I think the discussion over the exposure of  Kate's butt has shown a divide amongst people about standards of public behavior - some find it no big deal that her  private parts are exposed others think there are still public standards of modesty that make such exposures tacky at least.  The same will happen with protocol - it will fall increasingly by the wayside as younger people find it bothersome and irrelevant.

But protocol was invented to avoid conflict - not to assert superiority.  This becomes especially important at state and diplomatic functions - in a global society where people from different cultures find different things offensive - it is important to reduce those opportunities for friction by the use of common protocols.

I would not be surprised if the alphabetical seating arrangements did not result in some hurt feelings and some annoyed people.
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« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2014, 10:41:22 pm »

I'm sure that seating arrangement ruffled more than a few feathers. Have they been invited to any other royal functions (specifically, weddings)  outside of the UK since their wedding?
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« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2014, 11:15:52 pm »

i found it rather revealing that they didn't invite the POTUS and wife when other heads of countries were invited.  Eh.  Its a snub to be sure.

Schadenfreund!  Now, lets see some pictures of willy goofing around..........the boy blunder has done absolutely nothing with his life since he completed college.
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« Reply #11 on: May 31, 2014, 12:14:47 am »

POTUS would not typically attend a wedding - Truman did not attend Princess Elizabeth's wedding nor did anyone attend Margaret's.  If someone goes it would be FLOTUS - I think Nancy Reagan attended Charles and Diana's

Considering the security precautions that POTUS gets - it is impractical for a POTUS to attend.
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« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2014, 02:56:11 am »

^That's how I saw it. This wasn't appropriate for the POTUS to attend; not high enough of a profile and the security detail would be obnoxious.  And, if I recall properly, the guest list was, at one point, designed for foreign royalty primarily.  An Ambassador from the US would be the way to go here.  And some royal family declined to attend - Arab???  Can't recall, but right now the only two events I can see the POTUS attending would be the unfortunate death of the Queen or the coronation of Prince Charles (not sure about that one, though - might be more appropriate for the SOS to attend or FLOTUS).  That's how our protocol would normally run.

It might be helpful if I contributed the protocol for the office of the President of the US to see if there are any differences.  I'll get on that unless someone else finds that interesting to do.
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« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2014, 03:08:10 am »

Its not the President would have attended...its that they didn't think that one of England's main allies, the US, was important enough to invite to their wedding.

Yes, i consider it to be a snub.
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« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2014, 03:26:30 am »

Because William and Kate's wedding wasn't deemed a 'State Occasion' no Heads of State were invited other than extended family - such as the monarchs of Norway, Sweden, Denmark and Spain.

President Reagan was invited to Charles and Diana's wedding but couldn't attend due to the fact he was still recovering from the assassination attempt.

As for Coronations in the UK - protocol dictates that no Heads of State attend at all - Crown Princes and VPs but not the actual Head of State.

That could change in the future of course but that has been the case in the past.

Queen Mary changed the protocol on the Queen Consort of the previous monarch attending the coronation of the new monarch when she went to George VI's coronation but she hadn't intended on going to Edward VIII's. The decision was changed after the abdication to show a united fact to the world. So protocol can be changed if the circumstances warrant it.
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« Reply #15 on: May 31, 2014, 05:07:21 am »

^Right; all the same, it also wasn't certain that a President of the United States should in fact attend a royal wedding as his first overseas trip.

As for WK, I'm certain that these two are determinedly making up stuff as they go along to suit their preferences. to me this is a mistake since Kate has no clue about royal history (despite growing up in it as a subject of HM) and I honestly think that protocol should be changed once the royal is either Sovereign or Queen Consort.

That way it ensures that the person making the changes is fully used to the stuff that they know what truly works and what should be changed. Neither William or Kate are equipped to change anything and certainly, Kate's determination to have it both ways is leaving her more and more isolated.

Each time a royal disses protocol or sidesteps the Sovereign authority, they put themselves at risk. Marie Antoinette ignored etiquette and as a result, left her friendless during the Revolution and left her alone. The nobility could have pushed back and protected the monarchy, but she bypassed them for only a handful of favorites.

I do believe that visiting royalty should understand that when they come to the US, they have no business commandeering our police, blocking roads, and pushing the press around. I've never gotten over how WK wanted people to report photographers to the police, like some gestapo.
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« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2014, 05:36:57 am »

Quite a significant number of Commonwealth leaders were invited to William and Kate's wedding, though you would expect that. Heads of State wouldn't be there as William is only heir to the heir. It's not a State occasion.

I don't think you can blame William and Kate for any mistakes in the seating arrangements. Aides at Clarence House, under a Chief of Protocol would take care of those matters, or should.

The Lord Chamberlain at Buckingham Palace may well have been in overall charge of the procession from the Abbey and getting foreign dignitaries back to the Palace.

I remember Nancy Reagan was not happy with the seat she had at Charles and Di's wedding as she was back behind foreign royalty  but you can't please everybody.
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« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2014, 03:10:42 pm »

I'm not surprised that POTUS wasn't invited. It wouldn't have made sense, even from a courtesy standpoint. POTUS has nothing to do with the Royals other than the occasional meet & greet. His dealings are with the prime minister. Nancy R. was invited to Di/Charles' wedding because there was a personal relationship with the family. It was also a different time in the US & the masses weren't concerned with paying for a non-business trip. Folks gave POTUS flack for attending a friends' daughter's wedding (whom he's known since birth) a few weeks ago.
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« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2015, 10:43:36 pm »

You're not alone Janine: From Paul Keating's 'Lizard of Oz' moment to Michelle Obama hugging the Queen and LeBron James' sweaty arm around Kate, the most famous breaches of royal protocol

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3314833/You-not-Janine-Paul-Keating-s-Lizard-Oz-moment-Michelle-Obama-hugging-Queen-LeBron-James-sweaty-arm-Kate-famous-breaches-royal-protocol.html#comments
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« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2015, 11:25:25 pm »

lbr, the problem Kate has with Lebron is not that he was sweaty or touching her, it's that he is black. She tends to make that face around black people, unless you happen to be Beyonce & Jay Z. She's certainly okay with giggling around & publicly touching rich white guys she isn't married to  bored3
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