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Author Topic: Mark Shand (Camilla's brother) dies in NY  (Read 11385 times)
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rosielinks
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« Reply #40 on: May 02, 2014, 01:14:43 pm »

I guess you are right there. However, the piccies in the tabloids don't look good for the Windsor boys.

PW off on another little jaunt so soon after the holiday in the Maldives also seems to be ticking some people off.
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sandy
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« Reply #41 on: May 02, 2014, 02:49:28 pm »

This was about Camilla and her extended family. What didn't look good was having all the photo ops in the first place. It should have been private.  Maybe the boys had a tiff with Camilla and did not want to play happy families--maybe they never were "happy families" to begin with.
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« Reply #42 on: May 02, 2014, 02:50:22 pm »

^That's my issue, I guess.  It looks divisive and non-supportive, family-wise, to which people can relate.  It's one thing not to attend or be there, it's another to be seen partying when a funeral is going on.  There is no reason on this earth that a bachelor party is mandatory.  The wedding?  More important to attend but neither one of them are the best man and I'm sure an usher could have been found.

What bothers me about it is that it seems like a PR game between everybody but I could be mistaken.  Asking the media to be there for the funeral is unsettling, for instance.  It's a funeral, for God's sake, a time to put down petty grievances.  One thing I've really noticed is that the BRF still doesn't know how to handle the press.  They usually seem to get it dead wrong except for HM who I don't believe has ever been one hair out of place, figuratively and publicly.  No scandals, nada.  
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sandy
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« Reply #43 on: May 02, 2014, 02:54:52 pm »

I don't know Sandy - there are some writers who claimed PC was very depressed and disconsolate after Diana's death - perhaps in part because of her death but also because he felt everyone blamed him.  Supposedl;y the only one who could calm him down and get him out of these dark moods was Camilla.  Hence the willingness of the boys to accept her.  I don't know if that is true - it is what is said.

Charles was worried about himself. I would have bought into the "grieving" Charles spin if Charles had not relaunched the Camilla campaign less than a year after Diana died with tasteless headlines about Diana's sons accepting Camilla. Plus there was that Junor hatchet job about Diana which Charles apparently condoned (Junor had sent a manuscript of the book to Charles office according to Patrick Jephson). And lately Richard Kay said Charles felt "relieved" that Diana died.

Charles did not care two cents about Diana when she was alive even having that tasteless birthday party for Camilla at Highgrove in July 1997 so his "Grief" seemed very fake to me considering how quickly he returned to working on Camilla's image and getting Camilla accepted and having the tastelessness to release a story in July 1998 of Camilla being invited to tea by William. I have no respect for Charles or Camilla and he and Camilla deserve each other. She treated Diana like dirt from the get go. And even Charles cousin bashed Diana on two occasions--one on a show about the Queen's 50th anniversary on the throne and the other when she promoted the book. Charles sat back and condoned it. And I don't buy into the spin that he could not stop it. He made Camilla non-negotiable but he could not do the same for the deceased mother of his children. He is a disgrace.

Do you think William and Harry had a choice but to accept Camilla? I don't. She made their mother miserable and I think they are cordial to her but I don't buy into the spin that they are "close."
« Last Edit: May 02, 2014, 02:57:38 pm by sandy » Logged
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« Reply #44 on: May 02, 2014, 04:57:51 pm »

I don't see what Camillas kin have to do with William and Harry.  They don't owe her or her family anything but only a bit of tolerance for Charles' sake while Charles is alive.  It's a good thing Camilla has Ray Mill House should she outlive Charles. 
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« Reply #45 on: May 02, 2014, 08:02:09 pm »

^I would agree except that Will and Harry (+C&C) are selling that they are a big happy family. If you are close to your step mother and her brother dies it is expected for you to be there in the funeral.

I am not saying they shouldn't go to the wedding but right now they are on pre wedding events that are not important, they could have done both things IMO.
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« Reply #46 on: May 02, 2014, 09:28:15 pm »

sandy yes I do think his "depression" was because he saw how unpopular he as and how people blamed him for Diana and he was afraid he therefore would never see the throne.
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meememe
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« Reply #47 on: May 02, 2014, 10:31:01 pm »

I would never have expected William and Harry to attend simply because they are both so selfish that the idea of giving up a fun weekend in Memphis with their mates (remember William has even left Kate at home for this event) for anyone just would never have crossed their minds. Neither have an empathetic bone in their bodies it seems to me. They know the words to say but they don't have the actual ability to walk the walk to go with the talk.
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sandy
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« Reply #48 on: May 03, 2014, 01:17:45 am »

mememe, for all you know Charles told his sons to continue with their plans. William skipped other family events including the wedding of Peter Phillips and also one of  his Spencer cousins. This is nothing new.



sandy yes I do think his "depression" was because he saw how unpopular he as and how people blamed him for Diana and he was afraid he therefore would never see the throne.
(

Charles should have thought of all this when he kept Camilla on the side even though his wife minded this very much.  Charles would have had to be dragged away from the throne kicking and screaming. He never had to sacrifice a thing--he got the suitable wife and heirs, and got to marry the mistress who actually got rewarded with an HRH for her seedy behavior. Charles blamed everybody else for his own mistakes and bad choices. If you read his authorized biography he never took responsibility for any of his bad choices. Richard Kay in a recent story claimed Charles was "relieved." when Diana died. And Charles did not wait very long to relaunch the Camilla campaign and had his sons meet her. Tacky Tacky. Sorry I disagree. He also never made the mother of his sons non-negotiable and Diana is still slammed--one person on Larry King had the gall to say Diana was "better off dead." It's disgusting that Charles at least for the boys sake did not make Diana non-negotiable. I think he is very petty and small minded. Camilla deserves him and he deserves her. Penny Junor even has a new biography out about Harry--expect a lot of Diana bashing. I doubt Charles minds.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2014, 01:23:15 am by sandy » Logged
Rosella
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« Reply #49 on: May 03, 2014, 03:09:17 am »

Why didn't William ask Kate to be the representative for himself, and maybe Harry, at Mark Shand's funeral? That would have been acceptable, wouldn't it, and it's not as if Kate was doing anything else at the time.
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cate1949
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« Reply #50 on: May 03, 2014, 03:14:33 am »

^I was thinking the same thing - she certainly could have gone and it would have quieted the complaints about heartless Harry and Will partying in Miami/Memphis during the funeral.

But I wonder if again it is that whenever Will Harry or Kate show up they become the center of attention - and everything/one is swept aside?  So keeping them away allowed the focus to be on the mourning family as it should be?
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« Reply #51 on: May 03, 2014, 03:57:53 am »

IMO, the boys had made a commitment to Pelly and by going to the wedding they are fulfilling that responsibility.

Perhaps Kate should have represented Wm and Harry.  But, if she isn't on good terms with Camilla then it was better for her not to go.

It would have been nice if the boys had gone but IMO it's the gestures made afterwards that mean the most.  The friend that takes you to dinner on an anniversary or bc it's been a bad week, the friends and family that stop in for a drink or help you with packing, sorting, cleaning, etc...  The true gestures of love and friendship are the ones made after the craziness of a funeral is over.  It's afterwards that things are usually tougher.  The house seems empty, Holidays are tough, sorting out the estate and taxes.  The loyalists in your life are there during those times. 

It would mean a lot more to me to have someone call me a week later and drag me out of the house for a drink and a laugh.  Or for someone to visit and help me sort through the silver and photos.  I'd have told them to go, funerals are a celebration of life and remind us how precious life is.  The boys should be celebrating their friend's marriage in Memphis.  Camilla had plenty of support at the funeral, she wasn't exactly alone.

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« Reply #52 on: May 03, 2014, 10:37:39 am »

^I would agree except that Will and Harry (+C&C) are selling that they are a big happy family. If you are close to your step mother and her brother dies it is expected for you to be there in the funeral.

I am not saying they shouldn't go to the wedding but right now they are on pre wedding events that are not important, they could have done both things IMO.

But selling it for who's benefit? It's certainly not their's because the public could care less if they like Camilla, as everyone in the world knows how she came into the picture and think she's a snake for it. All of the happy family crap is for Charles and Camilla's benefit.

I most certainly don't give Harry and William flack for not going to the funeral of someone that, at the heart of it, has nothing to do with them, just because he's the brother of a stepmother they most likely are not close to at all.

It's also very strange that cameras were all of a sudden allowed at a private funeral, when these people have so many problems with cameras at events they shouldn't and just plain out and about moments, but at a very vulnerable, you-for-once-in-your-lives-have-a-valid-reason-for-telling-the-paps-to-get-lost moment, you all of a sudden welcome them??? Where do they do that at blink blink
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Rosella
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« Reply #53 on: May 03, 2014, 10:58:10 am »

Without being insensitive about Mark Shand's death, I do think press/photographers being allowed at the funeral has all the hallmark of Clarence House and PR. Hasn't Charles been trying (hopelessly) to make the British public warm to Camilla for about 15 years. Maybe he thought some tears might showcase her more human side?

 And, of course, she was terribly cut up, poor woman.Nevertheless, I wouldn't put it past him.
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« Reply #54 on: May 03, 2014, 11:13:52 am »

^ I wouldn't put it past him either. This man always, without fail, manages to do something or have something pop up that could be connected to his hands being in the pot, that's questionable. It's like meddling is his achilles heels.
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« Reply #55 on: May 03, 2014, 12:21:12 pm »

^,^^yes and probably The boys are tired of being used to promote Camz. I Feel a bit sorry for her on a personal level, but it doesn't wipe out her history and the impact it has had on them. She is reaping what she has sown.
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sandy
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« Reply #56 on: May 03, 2014, 04:01:49 pm »

Without being insensitive about Mark Shand's death, I do think press/photographers being allowed at the funeral has all the hallmark of Clarence House and PR. Hasn't Charles been trying (hopelessly) to make the British public warm to Camilla for about 15 years. Maybe he thought some tears might showcase her more human side?

 And, of course, she was terribly cut up, poor woman.Nevertheless, I wouldn't put it past him.

He also made sure there were close ups of his holding hands with her. So some of those who buy the spin in the comments were gushing about how much Charles loves her and this is so beautiful and Camilla's crying. I think Camilla is very cynical at heart--and had not public opinion stopped her she would have worked up some tears had she attended the 2007 Diana Memorial Service.After all she was only trying to "help" Diana, etc etc.  How C and C really feel about each other is subject to speculation but I think she is ecstatic that she got all the things Diana once had. And Charles had to try to whitewash the sordidness of their affair. Camilla was obviously upset by her brother's death but what bothered me was making the service about HER and it was all from her point of view not the rest of Shand's family. And I do think Charles is cynical enough to try to make this an "opportunity" for the people to view himself and Camilla as being "human". He is in their pitching all the time. And the low point was last year when an article in the DM said the Queen was "faltering" and even though Camilla looks older than the Queen making it seem how much less "faltering" he and Camilla are.

Charles lost me when he tried to play "widower" to Diana after he treated her like dirt when she was still alive. And then sat back and watched the posthumous bashing of Diana that he himself condoned, in any case he never made Diana "non-negotiable" like he did with Camilla.

Charles is bumbling along trying to make Camilla be "warmed to." And spent money. But he needs to face facts that not everybody is going to "adore" Camilla to put it mildly.
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cate1949
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« Reply #57 on: May 03, 2014, 08:45:20 pm »

It must be especially devastating to lose her brother- the father of that young woman - so unexpectedly too so I am not at all surprised to see her tears - I am sure they are genuine.  But it sure does make the impression that this was splashed all voer the papers with photos so as to create sympathy for her and increase the odds of people liking her.
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sandy
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« Reply #58 on: May 04, 2014, 01:15:58 am »

It is used for PR spin for C and C. Beginning with the treacly article of how it was Charles turn to comfort Camilla after she comforted him about the Queen Mum. It's odd that there was no mention of his comforting Camilla when her father died.  And making it seem that Camilla is the only next of kin that Mark had focusing on her. I saw photos of her crying but I still can't stand her. She caused many tears for the late Diana. Camilla is still a dreadful woman IMO and Charles is silly enough to think he can get everybody to "like her" by spending huge sums on spin doctoring. I see it more as a turn off. It would have been better had there been no photos out there.
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« Reply #59 on: May 04, 2014, 01:45:25 am »

There sure weren't many aristocrats at the funeral.  I don't think the Shand's are top drawer.
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