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Author Topic: The Duchy of Cornwall  (Read 25119 times)
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My2Pence
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« Reply #180 on: July 18, 2015, 02:53:51 pm »

Not sure if this belongs under Royal Finances or the Duchy of Cornwall (or Lancaster), so it is going both. If I can find her similar posts about the two Duchies I'll post that too, but it also shows none of these lands are the private property of the Windsors.

From a great poster over at Celebitchy, LAK. One who is extremely well-versed in royal history, far beyond what anybody might write on wikipedia.  It is from this article if copying her response isn't allowed.

http://www.celebitchy.com/429104/queen_elizabeth_fired_four_senior_staffers_royal_staff_morale_is_at_rock-bottom/


"The Sovereign grant money is 15% of the profits of the crown estates. The other 85% goes into the treasury to pay for public services.

Please note, one of the often repeated lies about the crown estates is that they belonged to the royal family once upon a time which makes people throw out the argument that we’d all be worse off if they ‘reclaimed’ the crown estates in the event of a republic.

The crown estates were carved out back during the Norman conquest to pay for the instrument of government. Since the royal household, particularly the monarch, was the government, this included them in the payment. However, the Crown estates never belonged to them, they were merely administrators the estates. The revenues were supposed to pay for government eg parliament, army, Royal household. With time, the definition of government services has expanded to included Judiciary, Police, NHS and other public services.

The governance of the crown estate became problematic for successive monarchs who frequently mismanaged it such that it was debt ridden. This recurring debt forced them to go to parliament to beg for tax raising measures to pay debts and ongoing obligations.

In 1760, George 3 transferred the management of the crown estates to parliament in exchange for a portion that covered the royal household. This became a ‘salary’ of sorts and was termed the civil list. Over the years, it’s been re-negotiated as far as what it is allowed to cover rather than blanket payment for everything that constitutes the royal household.

Unfortunately, the civil list was paid in arrears and was proving equally inadequate at meeting the costs of the royal household so it was renegotiated recently and decided that a blanket 15% of the crown estates profits should cover the costs, and renamed the Sovereign grant.

A list of what is covered by the sovereign grant is available and annual accounts are made public every year. "


"it wasn’t sold to the government. It has always belonged to the govt, but managed by the sovereign. The management of it was transferred from the sovereign to the government with condition that the sovereign’s *expenses were met. Those expenses are what was known as the civil list and are now covered by the Sovereign grant.

*Sovereign is/was still government which means their expenses in the service of govt is/was recompensed in the form of the civil list/sovereign grant. "

Edit, found more of their discussions about the Duchies not belonging to the Windsors

http://www.celebitchy.com/434264/prince_charles_spent_46_million_funding_the_cambridges_prince_harry

« Last Edit: July 18, 2015, 02:58:45 pm by My2Pence » Logged
Val
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« Reply #181 on: August 20, 2015, 07:58:01 am »

Many comments everywhere on the above - an example below

Anyway this is a big one. I wondered when Chas would make his bid for the entire Crown Estate to be handed over to him and he's making his move. That was why he pushed for the SSG to be linked to the profits of the CE aided an abetted by Osbourne and pushed through Parliament without much debate. If anyone tries telling you it's theirs anyway. It isn't. They do not receive any money from the CE it is being used as a bench mark and could just as easily have been pinned to the retail price index. Further the SSG comes out of general taxation.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3202953/EPHRAIM-HARDCASTLE-Prince-Wales-wants-financial-independence-state-King.html

I am sure Chas would like nothing better than to be handed over all the profits of this, and the Duchy of Lancaster whilst his useless son moves on to take the profits of the Duchy of Cornwall.
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Val
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« Reply #182 on: August 20, 2015, 08:04:16 am »

^

More -


'I understand that there is to be a review of the SSG this autumn as many MPs are angry at the increases and a fair few also annoyed at the way it was pushed through. PC was lobbying for this but so far no letters or emails have emerged.

The  crafty b----r is banking on being able to turn around and say ah well old boy it belonged to the monarch 300 years ago and I have now staked my bid to reclaim. However, the money comes from all our taxes and the 15% link to the CE is simply a marker and Osborne stated it could have easily have been linked to the RPI which is what I suspect MPs may well push for. In a way I do hope Corbyn forms an opposition as he is a republican and will hold the Tories feet to the fire over this.

There would be a constitional crisis if PC did try this on. Not least of which would be due to the Queen signing the Lisbon Treaty and with it her and our sovereignty. Technically she ain't the queen of anything any more.'



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gingerboy24
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« Reply #183 on: January 20, 2016, 02:13:31 pm »

Well of course chucky does not want to pen up info ret he Duchy of Cornwall  - we could see how extravagant he is then, that would never do  easter-lol


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/theroyalfamily/12108576/Prince-of-Wales-should-not-have-to-open-up-Duchy-of-Cornwall-to-public-scrutiny.html
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Ariel
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« Reply #184 on: January 20, 2016, 08:57:52 pm »

i didn't get it - is the 20mil a year dutchy private or public property and into whose pocket does the 20 mil go?
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meememe
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« Reply #185 on: January 20, 2016, 11:11:55 pm »

The Duchy was set up in the Middle Ages to provide the Duke of Cornwall and thus heir apparent to the throne with a private income to fund his private life.

The books of the Duchy are available to parliament annually with the breakdown as to how much is paid for official expenses for Charles, Camilla, William, Kate and Harry and how much he pays in salaries to official staff (not the exact amount per person of course but the total) and the amount he pays in tax (which under the terms of the Duchy he isn't required to pay at all but has done so voluntarily since he took over running it in 1966. He used to pay 50% in tax but cut it back to 25% when he married Diana so that he could cover her expenses.

What we don't get told is what he spends the money on for his private life - and we have no right to now that, any more than we have a right to know what other people want to spend their income on. He may give a lot to his charities, or other charities, spend it on luxuries, or hire lots of movies or who knows but he has as much right to spend his private income his way as anyone else. Some people will argue that as the money comes from taxpayers (but then so does the money for any other landlord e.g. the Duke of Westminster or Duke of Devonshire) they have a right to know what he spends it all on.

Note that it is only Charles that the press and Republic go after and not The Queen whose income from the Duchy of Lancaster estate is set up the same way. She didn't even pay any tax on that income until 1992 (so she had 40 tax free years) and had to be forced to do so kicking and screaming while Charles did so voluntarily from 1966 but it is always Charles who is targeted. No doubt when he becomes King they will go after the Duchy of Lancaster and leave the Duchy of Cornwall alone as William will be in charge of that then and so will get the permanent pass he gets as Diana's son.

Many people believe Charles shouldn't get any income from any source at all - meaning that the heir to the British throne would need to go to the job centre and register for unemployment benefits.
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gingerboy24
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« Reply #186 on: January 21, 2016, 09:58:09 am »

^^  The 20 million goes to chucky to fund his lavish lifestyle, including keeping the lazy lamebridges.  As it is taxpayer money then we still fund him, irrespective of the fact that it comes from the Duchy.  All stems from the taxpayer, whatever way you look at it.

Prince Charles's farm accused of eco-vandalism
Tribunal rules that Prince must hand over data on whether Duchy oyster farm is a risk to wildlife

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/prince-charless-farm-accused-of-eco-vandalism-6256927.html

I hope they carry through and make this definitely public, the Duchies do not belong to the royals personally, they get the benefits from them and therefore information should be made to the public.
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Freya
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« Reply #187 on: January 21, 2016, 10:54:19 am »

^
Everyone seems to think that Duchy products are made by Duchy. Some years ago I had a box of Duchy chocolates. They tasted vaguely familiar and I looked at where they were made. They were made by a firm that made Woolworths pick and mix chocolates and tasted very much like them. Now I quite liked Woolworth's pick and mix however there was a big difference in the price.

http://www.ashbury.co.uk/
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Ariel
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« Reply #188 on: January 22, 2016, 05:21:18 am »

thanks for all the clarifications. seems like to be a heir to the English throne comes with mil of income gifted by the public. pretty sweet job.
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Val
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« Reply #189 on: January 22, 2016, 09:13:57 am »

^^^

All this greed and money grabbing is just setting himself up to be even more disliked if he does become King.   
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gingerboy24
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« Reply #190 on: January 22, 2016, 09:22:02 am »

Yes, such a greedy man, totally selfish, self centred and all me, me, me,me and me all the time.  If he only realised what a total dork he is and what people really think of him.  Wonder what he would have turned out like had he been born to an everyday working person  -  I personally very much doubt he would have amounted to much.  Everything he has is given to him, never had to work a day in his life.  Even the Princes Trust is run by others, he attend various meetings etc but he is not a worker bee.
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Val
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« Reply #191 on: January 22, 2016, 10:31:14 am »

At least they have (hopefully) stopped trying to turn him in to a popular, man of the people, loveable funny man with a great sense of humour.  He just came across as a daft, sad dork, more of the village idiot variety.  Definitely shouldn't have anything to do with the running of the Duchy of Cornwall.  Whose dumb idea was it to have him reading the weather forecast a while  back too?  Doesn't anyone understand that we want a King we can respect?
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marion
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« Reply #192 on: January 22, 2016, 03:01:32 pm »

Is anyone in that family normal? 
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gingerboy24
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« Reply #193 on: January 22, 2016, 05:36:38 pm »

^Does not look like it. As dumb as they come and full of paedophiles, what a family to marry into, they think they are above everyone else when in fact there are better people, with morals and compassion, living in trailer parks.  Look up to and respect the rf  -  I don´t think so, never will I ever think of them as good people.  Not that I am ever likely to, but if I was in the same room as HM I would walk out, I would not want to be tainted by breathing the same air, that is how much she and her family disgust me now, and with just cause.
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« Reply #194 on: January 18, 2017, 06:57:35 am »

 
    A quote from someone from Truro Cornwall  re his "booklet" on global warming.

      "While I am a Royalist, I have no time for the greedy self aggrandising Prince Charles. He should take a leaf out of his Mothers book and keep clear of political issues. He is a hypocrite and a foolish one at that. If he is that concerned why does he not live the simple life, after all if anyone can afford it he can.."

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« Reply #195 on: January 18, 2017, 07:44:47 am »

I wonder how different things would be if in fact Charles were actually interested in making an educated study of the issue beyond asinine speeches. With his time and money, he could easily drown in the library with books and tutors and probably be able to make a much better speech at least.

It sounds to me like he would like to go back to the middle ages when people used herbal remedies instead of medical technology and lived off of naturally grown crops, even though chemicals have helped reduce pestilence and people don't starve if a single crop fails. I really do question his mind at times.
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« Reply #196 on: January 21, 2017, 06:55:16 am »

  Charles believes his own PR.   tehe
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marion
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« Reply #197 on: July 22, 2017, 02:34:57 pm »

Interesting piece re Betty's income from the Duchy of Lancaster - click on the link in the story to the Duchy of Cornwall accounts to shows that Charles gave £3 plus million to Bill Midds and Harry in 2017. I seriously cannot see either duchy surviving after the Queen goes. Extravagance beyond comprehension.


https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/19/queen-spend-mushrooming-pay-revenue-estate
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gingerboy24
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« Reply #198 on: July 22, 2017, 05:15:24 pm »

And she had to cheek to ask for a grant to repair the roof of BP a few years ago, the front of the woman.  It might not belong to her but she does get the glory of living there for free.
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leogirl
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« Reply #199 on: July 22, 2017, 07:24:14 pm »

If it doesn't belong to her, she might not legally be allowed to make repairs. For example, if you're renting a home you can't just decide to replace the roof or whatever, even if it is leaking.

She does live there for free and is very wealthy. I guess that's how they stay rich: hoard their stash and never spend it, and get the government/taxpayers to cover all their expenses.  dontknow
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