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Author Topic: The Transition to Charles' Reign  (Read 50112 times)
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« on: August 31, 2012, 04:48:36 pm »

Just read this tweet from one of the directors of Republic:

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Guy Craft‏@GuyCraft

 Senior palace figure told us that in the next few months Charles will adopt a “shadow king” role - enabling Liz to spend more time with Phil

Things are developing behind the scenes. We haven't seen Charles at all over the period of the Olympics.
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Alexandrine
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« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2012, 08:51:51 pm »

^^ His lack of participation in the olympics is very strange. It was his time to shine and he disappears?!

A theory is that he wanted the new generation to get the limelight but they don't need it since marrying Kate and William are in every mag.  dontknow

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« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2012, 08:52:24 pm »

This story has been circulating for the past few years. I think Charles PR sends this out. The Queen usually reacts by taking on a major tour or appearance. Charles needs to get over it and wait his turn. He certainly took advantage of Philip's absence during Jubilee events to put grinning Camilla in the coach next to the Queen and show his "scaled down" monarchy on the balcony.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2012, 08:55:15 pm by sandy » Logged
Alexandrine
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« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2012, 09:36:36 pm »

^^ the scaled down balcony was programmed before Philip's illness.

Maybe the other times were PR but now with Philip in not the best state and the Queen feeling the years this will happen in the short term.
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« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2012, 09:59:49 pm »

Some sources say that Philip would have asked all the children and grandchildren to come out. This has not been confirmed or denied.

The shadow king stories have been going on for years. And the Queen would quickly dispel them by doing more appearances. I think these stories are tacky and in bad taste especially now. Charles appears to be champing at the bit which is not the best sort of image he should be cultivating.
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meememe
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« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2012, 10:14:40 pm »

The scaled down balcony appearance was announced in March - long before Philip took ill.  Philip would have been involved in that decision back then and thus would have had his say - he wouldn't have changed it at the last moment - that story is more Charles bashing rather than actually looking into the truth of the matter.

The idea of Charles doing things to help his mother isn't new - he has been doing that his entire adult life - it is what the royal family does - support the monarch.  The heir more than others of course, because he is the heir - the next monarch.  He does investitures - as does Anne - whereas about 15 years ago they were all done by The Queen. 

If The Queen wants to spend more time with Philip then Charles will be the one to step up - and if The Queen becomes incapable of carrying out her duties Charles will take over, even if the Queen is still alive - that is the normal procedure.  That is how regencies work - the heir becomes the regent. 

Charles didn't 'disappear during the Olympics'.  He went to Scotland and carried out his traditional duties there such as attending the Mey Games along with 16 other engagements mainly in Scotland.  He supported other events that were going on in the country rather than the Olympic Games - he did the normal engagements rather than the ones that are showy for a couple of weeks but the ones he will be doing again next year etc.
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sandy
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« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2012, 10:24:01 pm »

Just reporting what I read. It is not "Charles bashing" if his father had the others come out at the last minute. As past history shows, royals can change what they originally said they would do.

Charles is nowhere near becoming Regent  IMO.That is premature. Charles is no spring chicken so theoretically William could be asked to be take over much of the duties. The Queen is in good health and I doubt Charles being regent is imminent. That is a serious step--George III was mentally incapacitated and his son took over for a time as Regent. I think it would have to be pretty dire for Charles to be named Regent.

Calling himself "shadow king" is a lot more than simply "helping out" his mother.
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« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2012, 01:19:58 am »

"Shadow King" equals "Shady King" to match a shady fam and a shady Prince.
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« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2012, 02:22:31 am »

As the Queen ages the chances that she could lose some or all of her faculties increases - I am not saying that she is losing her faculties but that the chances are increasing that she might.

If that happens Charles takes over.  It isn't a popularity contest but the law - the regent is the person next in line to the throne - simply logic.

William won't be regent for his grandmother unless his father is dead or equally unable to carry out those duties.

I know that there are people here who want William to succeed The Queen but I see them as simply nasty people who wish William to have to bury his father as well as having had to already bury his mother - which is simply a cruel wish.  The same as the people who wish The Queen to outlive Charles meaning that she has to bury her own eldest child - something no mother should have to do.  Having a friend, aged 92, who yesterday had to attend the funeral of her own youngest son and seeing how wretched she was all day tells me that no one should wish something like that on a mother.

Charles is only doing what The Queen asks him to do - stand in for her on occasions.  Like many children he may very well also be offering to stand in for her on those duties she finds most onerous but it is still her decision.  It was her decision that this year it would be her family who made the overseas tours representing her for the Jubilee and that duty has been shared between Charles and Camilla (Canada and still to come NZ, Aust and PNG), William and Kate (Singapore, Malaysia, The Solomons and Tuvalu later this month), Harry (Caribbean), Andrew (India), Edward and Sophie (The Caribbean and Gibraltar), Anne (Africa already done and more to come - Zambia later this month), The Duke of Gloucester (various tours earlier this year), The Duke of Kent (earlier this year).  This is hardly evidence that Charles is taking over - go back to 1977 and even 10 years ago most of these Jubilee tours were done by The Queen and Philip in person but this year they have been more spread out amongst the family.

If Charles was pushing himself forward he and Camilla would have been doing most of these tours, along with appearing more at the Olympic Games, especially representing the Queen at the closing ceremony but instead they have only been doing their normal activities and adding some extras for the Jubilee. 

As Charles is the heir and Camilla his wife and future consort of course they are going to take some of the central positions such as at the Jubilee when Philip was taken ill.  It was always going to be Charles who made the tribute to his mother at the concert, just as he did 10 years ago.  All that happened differently to what was originally planned, after Philip took ill, was that The Queen decided not to travel back to BP in a carriage by herself and moved her son and his wife into the carriage with her.  Protocol demands that women face forwards and men backwards when three in the carriage like that and so Camilla was seated next to the Queen.  It would have been totally wrong for that configuration to be any other way.  The Queen could have travelled alone and still had three carriages - Charles and Camilla in the second one with William, Kate and Harry in the third but the decision was to go with only two carriages after Philip took ill.
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sandy
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« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2012, 02:29:04 am »

I'm sure the royals make all these plans in case...But since there is no need for Charles to "take over" yet the PR or press or whatever should just not trumpet the Shadow King Stories. I think it is in bad taste. It's rather like vultures circling IMO anyway.

I think the Queen should have traveled alone in the carriage. Charles IMO used it to put out PR about how the Queen is "warming up" to Camilla so she wanted HER to sit with her.  Charles always puts his own spin to the forefront IMO and seized the moment to put Camilla next to his mother.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2012, 02:31:55 am by sandy » Logged
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« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2012, 09:18:56 am »

^ Or maybe Liz really like Cam  Cool...
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« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2012, 10:29:23 am »

The Queen probably gave C&C an upgrade to the front carriage because she didn't want to ride alone.  End of story really.

I hope the tweet is correct, and the Queen is going to scale back to spend more time with her husband.  She's 86 years old - she should be scaling back, especially since his health is not good.  I will be surprised if he lives more than another year or so - really he could go at any time.  When I think of the Queen still doing her duties and not seeing enough of him it makes me feel sad.

I've resigned myself to the fact that Charles will be centre stage until he dies or the monarchy is disestablished (which I'm predicting for 10-20 years out).  William doesn't even want to do royal duties - he just wants the trust fund, polo ponies, and shooting weekends.  Same as most of his forbears.

Charles is unpopular, especially in Australia and New Zealand.  He will find it harder and harder to hang onto the monarchy once the Queen is gone.
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« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2012, 10:58:26 am »

If this is true, it seems like its similar to the US Presidential "transition period" between the election & the swearing in a new president. The president still "calls the shots" but will listen to the opinions of the president-elect.

Obviously, it isn't exactly the same, but maybe HM is willing to spend more time with her husband & give a little more weight to Prince Charles' opinion?
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« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2012, 12:29:42 pm »

I don't see the monarchy ending within the next 20 years or so (I am not even sure that Australia will be a republic by then given the upswing in support for the monarchy over recent years).

As the general public still seem enamoured of William and Kate they will put up with Charles as King to see William King at the very least - unless he does something so outrageous that they will fully turn on him - not just a few people but large crowds.

The Republic group in the UK might make a lot of noise but doesn't really register with the populace with the lastest polling figures I can find putting support for the monarchy in the UK in the 70% range and nearly 60% in Australia the highest in a generation.  In NZ I don't know anything about the republicans there but I do know that in Australia the two major parties have basically committed to us remaining with the British monarchy for the rest of HM's reign which could easily be another 15 years and I don't see Britain becoming a republic during her lifetime either.  From what I can find out neither of the major political parties in NZ even have the republic as part of their party platform, unlike Australia where the Labor Party does have is part of their programme but even they haven't tried to conduct a referendum since coming to power in 2007 - 5 years and no attempt because they know it wouldn't get up.
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sandy
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« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2012, 04:14:57 pm »

^ Or maybe Liz really like Cam  Cool...

Well she never commented on it. I think she had to cater to her spoiled son. I somehow don't think there is any love lost between them but I think she tolerates her. I don't think there is anything warm and fuzzy going on between them. Charles probably sulked and the Queen let Camilla ride with her. The Queen has ridden alone in carriages many a time so th is WAS somewhat unusual.
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« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2012, 04:16:33 pm »

The Queen probably gave C&C an upgrade to the front carriage because she didn't want to ride alone.  End of story really.

I hope the tweet is correct, and the Queen is going to scale back to spend more time with her husband.  She's 86 years old - she should be scaling back, especially since his health is not good.  I will be surprised if he lives more than another year or so - really he could go at any time.  When I think of the Queen still doing her duties and not seeing enough of him it makes me feel sad.

I've resigned myself to the fact that Charles will be centre stage until he dies or the monarchy is disestablished (which I'm predicting for 10-20 years out).  William doesn't even want to do royal duties - he just wants the trust fund, polo ponies, and shooting weekends.  Same as most of his forbears.

Charles is unpopular, especially in Australia and New Zealand.  He will find it harder and harder to hang onto the monarchy once the Queen is gone.
The Queen has ridden alone many a time. Some theorized that Camilla was put next to her so there would be no booing of Camilla (had she ridden with Charles.) Some still boo Camilla...

The Queen won't give up her most of her duties and give them to Charles before she dies IMO.
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Jane23
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« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2012, 04:31:47 pm »

^ Video of anyone booing Cam  flower...of course given that you say she is booed you have a video...other than that Liz is 86 so it's only normal her son the next Monarch helps her finally scale down her duties take in consideration the woman just undertook a tour around the country for The Jubilee it has been a crazy summer and Harry just made it crazier  easter-lol...
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« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2012, 07:20:29 pm »

Not everybody thinks Camilla is great to put it mildly. There were boos of Camilla at the W/K wedding reported. The Queen can scale down all she wants but I don't think she will name Charles "Shadow King." I think more in his dreams.
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Jane23
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« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2012, 09:05:23 pm »

^ He is indeed a "shadow" King so the man doesn't need to dream it.
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« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2012, 10:55:34 pm »

I doubt the Queen will make a grand announcement.

"Shadow King" implies the King behind the scenes, not the one "the people" believe or recognize as King. Haven't y'all read any books about conspiracy theories?
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